Always On - What are your numbers?

General Sense Discussion
#1

I’ve had my Sense for several weeks now, and despite a bit more discipline in controlling my usage, my Always On power is at 415W, and that includes the following:

  1. Multiple lighted switches/outlets
  2. Modem/Router/UPSs
  3. Aquarium Pump
  4. Radon Pump
  5. various small devices (Google/Alexa speakers, …)

I also have 9 dedicated DCMs (2 Sense CTs and 7 KP115 plugs). My questions then are:

  1. The ‘Always On’ bubble, does it include the ‘Always On’ from the other bubbles as well ?

If that’s the case, then my Total always on jumps to 560 W … which is not small.

#2

We were just having the same discussion here.. The definition below indicates that the whole house Always On is determined independently from the individual device Always Ons.

If that’s the case, then you can kind of mentally subtract off your device Always Ons from your whole house Always On as part of your Always On accounting. I say “kind of” because the two aren’t derived exactly the same - different sample resolution, different time period, different ways of “binning”.

#3

Thank you @kevin1. I realize the math is a bit fuzzy at times, and I encounter that all the time in my line of work, so, no issue there.

So, here is a ‘related’ question: My ‘others’ gray bubble is sometimes there and sometimes not. From my experience (when I had the DCM/CTs) installed wrong, when such gray bubble is not present, it suggests some ‘net/negative’ power somewhere across all bubbles.

Also, I sometimes see a ‘Central Heat’ near 250W, and have no clue what that is. I have a dedicated DCM/CT on the furnace motor, and nothing else that can explain the Central Heat bubble.

All in all, I’m starting to see some ‘inconsistencies’ and not sure how to trouble-shoot/diagnose those… especially in the presence of fuzzy math.

#4

My take is that you are doing the right thing and what most users try to do, especially in the early going with Sense - do the detailed accounting to resolve bottom up detection and smart plug data with the top down house-level Total Consumption and Always On numbers. Plus, trying to reduce Other while also trying to reduce overall usage.

Just a couple thoughts on how not to go out of your mind dealing with “fuzzy numbers”:

  • Look at daily, weekly or monthly data instead of instantaneous (bubble) data when trying to do the accounting. Instantaneous data bops around too much for easy accounting, as you suggest.
  • I actually prefer working with Sense hourly exported data and re-aggregating myself for these calculations since it enables me to notice things like “missing hours” (zeros and NA data) that the Trends view hides.
  • I’m getting ready to take a look a a full year of 2020 data from a weekly perspective. But for me, that means aggregating some additional bottom-up data from my second Sense and from my own EV charging “detector” algorithm, then cleaning out duplicates, before analyzing.

As for the known undetected and mysterious and unknown detected devices - learn to live with a little uncertainty but continuously keep trying to fill in the blanks. Setting an alert on ‘Central Heat’ and looking at the Device Power Meter waveform might give you enough info to find the mystery devices. I had a mystery ‘Heater’ device like than until one day I saw an alert pop up the exact second I heard a slight noise in my kitchen - I discovered the ‘Heater’ was my much forgotten instant hot water heater.

#5

Thank you @kevin1. I have a water dispenser in the kitchen, it provides both cold/hot water. It could be possible that the ‘Central Heat’ bubble is picking the heater part of the dispenser. I need to put a smart plug on it and see what happens.

What I have seen in the past (though not much lately) is that often, when the dishwasher runs (most likely the dry cycle), I see two bubbles getting large (Heat1 and DCM1), and the two bubbles have very similar wattage. I have my dishwasher on a dedicated DCM/CT. Is Sense not smart enough to tell it is reporting the same device twice? What’s even more strange is that the total wattage (adding up all the bubbles) is very close to the total displayed in the top-right corner… talk about fuzzy math.

#6

148W. Half of that is from two cable box, wifi, modem and tv.

#7

My always on is 187W.
The biggest devices would be
1 TV DVR box (DirecTV), Blu Ray player
2 Cable internet, routers, UPS, printer
3 Many lighted switches and smart wifi switches (dozens)
4 refrigerator, thermostats, doorbell, alarm system

#8

:flushed: 700 so far
2 saltwater aquariums (return pumps, skimmers, power heads, reactor are full time, then heat and lights on and off) , venmar air exchange,
not sure what else, feels like tons of stuff… dish dvr + 3 additional boxes, 8 tvs, 2x battery tenders and a ctek 4.3 charger, big denon receiver 5.1 setup, media players, computers,
i guess I could turn off the fish tanks, and see the drop, turn off the venmar and see that too, those are the big users, but doubt its 300w total …

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#9

I finally got my desktop to sleep overnight, so I’m at 140w.

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