Is it time for Sense to,,,

Is it time for Sense to develop its own in-line sub-metering devices. Something that could go between an appliance and the power outlet. Maybe even versions for 220 (i.e. drier) and 110 (both 15 amp and 20amp). I really don’t believe control is even needed in these devices. Since other control and monitor devices already exist. Although they have their own disadvantages.

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There’s already a request for the same here:

Go there and like that Wishlist item.

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@eric.jilot, your statements make it sound like your are not familiar with the smart plug integration that Sense supports. Of course support only exists for 3 different smart plug models, and each only support 120VAC.

Many of us would welcome a 240VAC smart plug version.

I would also welcome a device that has a pair of CTs to clamp around hard wired 240VAC (or 120VAC) leads where a plug is not feasible. Heck, I’ve been thinking of getting a IoTaWatt device, which supports up to 14 CTs, and modifying its firmware (which is open source) to support the simple broadcast UDP protocol that the HS110 smart plug uses (and which Sense supports).

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A post was merged into an existing topic: Remote sensors for 240V

This +1000

@james_reilley You would be wrong about that. However no version of these devices support the higher voltage, at least in the states. Additionally none are just a simple metering device. Something I can use with my fridge and not worry about it losing power. By being turned off by accident or not returning to it’s previous (powered on) state after a power failure. Not to mention both the TPLink and WeMo units max at 15amps, which would be problematic with certain devices.

TP-Link default is to come back ON after a power failure. Wemo, not so much…

I agree that these energy monitoring smart plugs having relays in them that could shut off the power is a potential problem. I do use HS110 on my 4 refrigerators (well, I have 2, but then I have an ice machine and wine cellar), and I have a worry in the back of my head that the relays might shut off their power, but this has never happened to me.

Note, the Wemo smart plugs have the design choice/flaw to have their relays set to cut the power after a power outage is restored. Certainly the Wemo plugs should not be used for critical loads like refrigerators or communications devices. I only use HS110’s now, and would not recommend the Wemo for energy monitoring due to this choice/flaw.

Sense has a way to turn off its ability to turn on/off smart plugs. I have mine configured to not be capable of turning them on/off…I just want Sense to benefit from their energy monitoring.

I do wish that there were cheap wifi smart plug variants that didn’t even have an internal relay…only energy monitoring.

I do wish that there were cheap wifi 240V (at up to 50A) energy monitoring plugs that could monitor both legs of the typical American split-phase system.

I do wish that there were cheap wifi devices that had 2 CTs to monitor any arbitrary loads (that I’d use for either 240VAC 50A hardwired loads or for 2 different 120VAC 20A hardwired loads).

I do wish that all 3 of such devices, if they exist in the market, could integrate with Sense.

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I am familiar with the TP-Link devices. Unfortunately they do not support HomeKit, 1of my requirements for control devices.
The other issue with WeMo and TP-Link devices is that they only have a 15 amp max rating. One more reason they should not be used with larger appliances.
Plus by Sense making a monitor only device, hopefully it will not run into the device limits, I’ve read about on this forums.

Better than a $40 metering device, how about a $44 programmable timer for 240V that let’s you limit your hot water to just when you want to use it? https://amzn.to/2vuQwqo

If it was a matter of a consistent schedule and having control that would work. But the schedule in my home is anything but consistent, so it’s not even a viable option, for the devices that I need better control of.
Beyond that it is more about monitoring then control and better identification of always on devices and the power they are consuming. Especially the one on 20amp circuits. 15amps are easy TO-Link and WeMo are readily available. But I have not been able to find a 20amp, beyond the ConnectSense In-wall outlet’s. Which if where compatible/integrated with Sense, I’d install.

That’s one reason I was originally holding off using this word plug for my refrigerator’s energy monitoring but the fridge is only rated at 7.7 amps so I’m probably be okay. Sense has already found the refrigerator but that’s with many of these devices I’m not sure if it’s accuracy. So maybe I’ll just plug it into a TP link plug for a week without assigning it and just see if it is accurate.

Yeah the problem with that I think is for me anyway I have a heat pump water heater and I only run it in heat pump mode because it’s a lot more efficient. The only potential downside is it takes a lot longer to heat the water but it uses so much less electricity it’s still proficient as resistant mode. With three of us in the house in the 50-gallon tank we have never had an issue with hot water though but if it turned off and on it might be an issue because the tank temperature wouldn’t be monitored off then we could turn it on it would take too long to heat the water

I’d also welcome a 220v smart plug (e.g. for electric range and electric dryer); not the mass-market as for 110v plugs, since many 220v appliances have their “socket” rather hidden (e.g at the back under the oven, or behind the dryer) and not easy for sticking one in … and may be rather sensitive to physical constraints (e.g. appliance designed to butt right up to the plug, and any additional ‘extension’ of an energy monitoring plug might cause ‘fit’ issues).

Such devices could free up the “Dedicated Circuit” for another 220 device which may be hard-wired from the panel (e.g. HVAC).

As much as I’d like to see 240V smart-plugs, the take rate will be VERY low. 240V is typically used in Ovens/Dryers/Furnaces

  1. Furnaces - they typically have a direct connection from electrical panel, and no room to install a smart plug
  2. Ovens - Some do not use plugs, they’re hard-wired to the wall - Ovens are ‘stationary’, no need for a plug. Connect them once then forget them.
  3. Dryers - not all markets/areas use 240V. In neighboring MI, it’s mostly all electric there. In IL however, it’s mostly gas dryers, which use only 120V to power the motor that spins the drum.

The point is, even if Sense comes up with a 240V smart-plug, the take rate is very small, and I have a hard time seeing that economically feasible. There is no way they can sell it for $20-30 like the TP-Link plugs. Are we willing to pay $50+ for a 240V smart plug? … I doubt it.

There’s also this DIY option that seems to have worked well for several people.