Cant see my Living room TV, Must be my UPS


#1

Sense saw my bedroom TV a month or so ago. I was happy
when that happened.

I was mystified when the living room TV was never discovered.
It was the same model but it was never seen.

This morning I figured out that my living room TV is connected
to our living room UPS. Maybe that’s the reason why I have
never seen the router, the DVR’s and the other network equip.

Also this might be why I always have such a large ‘Other’ load.

Just thought you would like to know.

Carol


#2

Even if the UPS isn’t causing it, routers, DVRs and other devices that are never switched off aren’t likely to be detected. They are going to be part of your “Always On” bubble. “Other” is stuff that switches on on an off, but hasn’t been detected yet.


#3

Good morning Kevin,

Regardless of the status of the DVR and the router (plus other network devices)
I am most interested in why the TV is not being recognized. I see the power levels
change when I turn on the TV and then turn it off again.

Thank you for your response.

Carol


#4

It’s likely that the UPS distorts the living room’s signature sufficiently that it doesn’t look like a typical TV on and off. The steady state power level is only a small, and possibly highly variable part of the signature.


#5

What brand is your TV? The other TV thread had people reporting success with Samsungs.


#6

My TV sets, all 3, are VISIO. The Bedroom TV’s have been discovered.
Thy are 32" TV’s. The one not discovered is a 42" TV (E420VL).

The Living Room TV is on every day, during the day time.
The Bedroom TV is on most nights.

Carol


#7

It’s not absolutely 100%, but we’re getting good results detecting Samsung, LG, and Sony. But they have to be on the same network that Sense is on as well as on the same subnet. That doesn’t mean we will only detect those TVs, but we’re getting the most reliable detections there.


#8

I’ve had Sense installed for over a year, and my main TV still hasn’t been detected either…so don’t feel bad. Could a nicer surge protector/power strip also complicate detection, since there’s multiple pieces of electronics plugged into a strip, that presumably, has some sort of filter on it?


#9

It’s possible, but unlikely. You could try without the surge protector and see what happens, but it really shouldn’t make much of a difference.


#10

AFIK, a surge protector strip really shouldn’t affect Sense’s ability to see the power signature of your TV. The strip is to protect from HUGE voltage spikes and the better ones do have high frequency noise filters, but normal power changes due to on/off cycles are both low amplitude and low frequency, particularly for things like TV’s.

BTW, in 15 months, Sense hasn’t found either of my TV’s, neither of which is on an individual surge protector (I do use “whole house” surge protection, but that’s before both the TV’s and Sense. Nor has it found any of my 6 computer monitors, none of my 5 computers, etc.


#11

@RyanAtSense - On this topic, could you run a question past the engineers that may be helpful for us?

With regard to the TV or other device contributing data via “Network Identification” required to be on the same network and subnet, If our home network is subnetted, usually for broadcast control, If we were to temporarly move some of our TVs to the same subnet as sense until they were detected, would then moving them to a different subnet prevent sense from continuing to pick up those devices turning on and off?

Personally, I separate my wifi devices from my wired devices for performance. But I’d be willing to move some wired to my wireless subnet for the purpose of detection as long as I could move them back to wired later and continue to have sense “see” it power on and off.

Thanks.


#12

Just checked on that and unfortunately they rely on that network connection for ID in perpetuity, so removing them from that network will kill the device ID.


#13

Good to know! Thank you.

Time to create a new SSID and move my sense to the wired network permanently. :+1:


#14

I’m curious how literal the ‘same network’ statement here is.

For example, most of my TV’s are connected to the network via hard-wired Ethernet connections while the Sense is obviously connected via WiFi. If the physical network (Cisco) and the WiFi network (Eero) are bridged together and use one IP subnet, one VLAN and gateway, is this going to work? Or would I need the devices to be on the WiFi network with the Sense for network identification to work?

My Sense has only been running for a week but to date, the only thing it has found is the refrigerator in the garage and nothing else. I would have hoped it might find the air handler for the A/C by now since that’s on and off all day this time of year.But, I’m not the most patient person when it comes to stuff like this.


#15

@don1 - from what you describe, you should be good.

When you separate your networked devices onto different ip subnets with different gateways, broadcast traffic will not cross your routed gateways. That’s where sense will only see broadcasts from devices on the same subnet.


#16

Thanks. That what I kind of assumed but experience has taught me not to blindly assume the obvious to be true.

I guess I’ll need to rethink my planning to segment my IOT devices in the house to their own subnet.


#17

I have two responses to this thread.

  1. My Vizio is not connected to any physical network. It is connected to the Directv DVR though.

  2. Make a larger network by changing the Subnet mask on the router and all permanently
    assigned network devives. I currently have a subnet of 255.255.255.0. Making it twice as
    large is 255.255.254.0. The subnet range would be 192.168.0.0-192.168.1.255
    This might mean the need for another subnet in the house unnecessary. Change amounts
    to 512 devices vs 256 in the older network.

Carol


#18

For networking good practice, you definitely shouldn’t make any subnets larger. But I doubt sense has much of a chance finding your TV at all of its not connected to the same ip subnet as sense. Either via wifi or wired.


#19

I have network identification turned on but my Samsung is an older plasma that can’t network in so maybe I should disable the setting. My plasma hasn’t been detected in the 3 months I’ve had sense.


#20

@senseinaz,
In the user call Sense had a few months ago, the R&D folks indicated that plasma TVs are incredible noise generators, that when turned on, might swamp out recognition of other devices. The issue is that plasma TVs use a fair amount of power that varies wildly depending on the picture on the screen. There is no clean “on signature”, plus TV operation might even mask other on and off signatures.