Duplicate issue / question

[nixhome2020]

I have a LG Microwave in the Kitchen that was being detected by Sense without a smart plug.

But, I wasn’t sure that Sense was detecting it properly when running at lower power levels other than 100%.

So I put it on a TP-Link/Kasa EP25 smart plug and deleted the originally “device” that was detected by Sense.

All was well, as Sense saw the LG Microwave that was connected to the EP25.

Then a few day later or so, I noticed that the microwave was being detected again while the microwave is connected to the EP25.

Is this normal? I have quite a few additional Kasa EP25 and Kasa Smart Plug Power Strip HS300’s monitored power loads, and this is the only one that I’m aware of that is being detected by sense at the same time sense is monitoring the load via a Smart Plug

Well, that might not be an accurate statement, as I see Five “Heat” power loads, that I’m not sure what any of these are. I have three space heaters in the house two on EP25’s, one fed from an HS300.

I guess I need to delete those five, and pay more attention to what powered up and is discovered by Sense independent of the Smart Plugs and Strips.

What’s the best way to deal with this issue with the Microwave specifically?

Why are the detected power levels for the Microwave via the Smart Plug, and the Microwave as detected by Sense, not equal?

SJ

[obscuredtrip]

@nixhome2020

Is this normal?

Totally.
Sense is reporting the plug as one device and the device as a separate device.
Sense (for good reason I’ll describe at the end) does not auto merge a natively detected device with a plug.

@nixhome2020

What’s the best way to deal with this issue with the Microwave specifically?

If you plan on keeping the plug on the microwave simply tell Sense what’s connect to this (the natively detected microwave). Devices → LG Microwave (the plug) → the cog or settings → Manage → What’s connected to this? → and check box the Microwave.

This will prevent the duplication of the devices.

What happened to you is that you deleted the native detection of the microwave and Sense rediscovered it (quite quickly).

@nixhome2020

Why are the detected power levels for the Microwave via the Smart Plug, and the Microwave as detected by Sense, not equal?

Because a native detection is only an educated guess whereas a plug reports the actual wattage of what’s connected to it. The native detected microwave may only be the inverter (heating portion) component of the microwave where as the plug’s wattage also includes everything else, light, controls, fan, rotating tray motor, etc…

@nixhome2020

I guess I need to delete those five, and pay more attention to what powered up and is discovered by Sense independent of the Smart Plugs and Strips.

You could, but I would leave them there until your positive it’s not an accurate detection. A heat device could be one many many different things. Defrost cycle on fridge, part of an ice maker, Keurig keeping keeping it’s water heated for your next cup (big vampire drain), an Aquarium heater, heat cycle on electric dryer, electric water heater. You may also see multiple heat devices for the same device, A space heater on low may be one heat device, the same heater on high may be another heat device. The same for dryer heat cycles and so on. If one turns out to be a setting of a device or component and you are sure about it you can merge the appropriate heat device into the main device.

By not telling Sense “what’s connected to this” you can compare the plugs data with that of your unknown devices. If an unknown device is a close match to that of the plug. You now know what the unknown is. You can then properly label the unknown device, or merge it if you plan on keeping the plug there. Or you could move the plug around trying it with different things plugs in until you find a match and so on…

[nixhome2020]

@obscuredtrip

@nixhome2020

What’s the best way to deal with this issue with the Microwave specifically?

If you plan on keeping the plug on the microwave simply tell Sense what’s connect to this (the natively detected microwave). Devices → LG Microwave (the plug) → the cog or settings → Manage → What’s connected to this? → and check box the Microwave.

This will prevent the duplication of the devices.

Ok, thank you for the explanation of how to Merge, and why I’m doing it. Wasn’t completely clear to me how to deal with this issue, FYI, if anyone from Sense is watching, I Merged in my Browser on my PC and was presented with:

So looks like a bug in the code

@obscuredtrip

What happened to you is that you deleted the native detection of the microwave and Sense rediscovered it (quite quickly).

I assumed (in error), that by plugging an appliance such as the Keurig, for example, with it’s heating element, a water pump and on my model, a milk frother built into it, that the TP-Link/Kasa EP25 Smart Plug would shield Sense from seeing the Keurig’s components as separate loads and simply use the EP25 power detected as what it presented to me as the full load for that device.

I guess that functionality is not something Sense sense is capable of.

If Sense was capable of such a feat, I can’t think of a reason why I wouldn’t want it to offer this feature. I would rather use the total from the EP25 for the Keurig’s power consumption, rather than have to guess what detected loads need to be combined into the Keurig’s EP25

Likewise with many other things I have plugged into EP25’s or HS300’s

Which begs the question of, if Sense is detecting my Microwave via the EP25, and also as if the Plug was not installed, then I wonder why it hasn’t detected the multitude of devices that I have behind EP25’s and HS300’s. Perhaps it will as time goes by, and I’ll need to merge those in as that occurs.

@obscuredtrip

A space heater on low may be one heat device, the same heater on high may be another heat device.

For this scenario with a space heater (which I have a few on EP25’s), I should then combine the Low and High detected setting into the Plug once I have verified that is where the load is coming from, correct?

@obscuredtrip

By not telling Sense “what’s connected to this” you can compare the plugs data with that of your unknown devices. If an unknown device is a close match to that of the plug. You now know what the unknown is. You can then properly label the unknown device, or merge it if you plan on keeping the plug there. Or you could move the plug around trying it with different things plugs in until you find a match and so on…

I will have to dedicate one plug to this purpose of trying to label any of my unknowns that are detected by Sense.

Thank you for the info.

SJ

[obscuredtrip]

@nixhome2020

So looks like a bug in the code

For some reason this happens a lot when merging devices. It’s a display issue, the proper name should appear everywhere else. I think @JamesDrewAtSense is aware.

@nixhome2020

I guess that functionality is not something Sense sense is capable of.

It’s more so an issue with the plugs. While the plugs are accurate (to determine wattage) they don’t provide the high resolution in millisecond detail that Sense needs for accurate native device detection.
Auto merging would cause a whole bunch of other issue too should the plug go offline, you plug something else into it or move the plug.
Sense does not incorporate the plugs in any way into the machine learning process. Way too many things could go horribly wrong on the backend.

@nixhome2020

Which begs the question of, if Sense is detecting my Microwave via the EP25, and also as if the Plug was not installed, then I wonder why it hasn’t detected the multitude of devices that I have behind EP25’s and HS300’s. Perhaps it will as time goes by, and I’ll need to merge those in as that occurs.

Sense can detect things behind a plug but a plug does NOT help Sense to natively detect the device.
Microwaves are pretty easy for Sense to natively detect which is why it was re-detected again so quickly while other devices have not yet or may not ever be. The plug had no part in it.

@nixhome2020

I will have to dedicate one plug to this purpose of trying to label any of my unknowns that are detected by Sense.

Thank you for the info.

A lot of people do exactly this. I think @kevin1 coined the term “roamer” and is the forum expert when it comes to describing various methods.

[JamesDrewAtSense]

@obscuredtrip

For some reason this happens a lot when merging devices. It’s a display issue, the proper name should appear everywhere else. I think @JamesDrewAtSense is aware.

I just wanted to provide a quick update I have an engineering ticket out to resolve this. I’ll update this thread when I can confirm this has been resolved. Thanks for your help!!