Identified Device Not Consistent


#1

My Sense has been working quite well, identifying the major devices around my house that I have been concerned with. One thing I have noticed is that while it has identified the water heater, which is one of the major things I wanted to track because I think it is hogging too much power, it does not consistently track it. What I mean is that maybe half the time, it will show up in the “other” category unless I power cycle the breaker for the water heater. Once it comes back on, it the IDs it and says it is on. This is also occurring with a space heater as well. Most of the time is correctly says it is on but sometimes it puts it in the other category. Could this be because the signature is getting lost in the baseline electrical noise? I could understand for the little space heater but for the water heater which is pulling near 5k watts, I would think it should stand out and be recognized. Any input is welcome.

Trey


#2

Hi Trey.

How long have you been a Sense user, and how long ago was your hot water tank detected?

Even though an item has been detected it’s been my experience that Sense will continue to further refine it’s on/off detection as time goes on, so if it’s a recent detection or you’re a reasonably new Sense user, a little more patience may be just what’s needed. :slight_smile:


#3

Just a couple of weeks. I am not overly concerned just yet as I believe that 1) I have a very noisy electrical system and 2) it likely needs more time to truly be able to pick it out when there is a bunch of background noise. I need to look and see what the noise floor is when it gets lost.


#4

I’m starting to think that some devices have different signatures depending on their operating mode that Sense can’t detect correctly right away.


#5

You mention “noise” in this post and I have some of the same problems as you.
I’m not an electrical engineer but I believe(based on my knowledge) that the term noise. Doesn’t really apply with sense.
The only time I have seen “noise used for electricity is for telecom where noise refers to what’s happening in the background.
Anyone that has used a meter of any kind or a oscilloscope knows that it’s a visual thing. I think where they have a background in voice recognition that they use an analogy that is not accurate. It gives us the impression of sound when there is t any sound involved.


#6

Electrical “noise” is very real. There’s a wealth of information on it out there, including a lot of stories on how to mitigate it since it can indeed cause a lot of issues, problems with Sense aside.

Here’s some interesting reading:

https://www.eetimes.com/document.asp?doc_id=1274125


#7

Do you also see where noise does not line up with actual use or voltage? What the CR clamps measure is only the electromagnetic properties and not anything thermal. So for noise to be picked up it would have to come from a direct connection to the line source in my mind. Meaning it’s a combination of CT clamp measurements AND from the line feeder lines powering sense itself. I don’t think can do just CT clamps, there just isn’t enough information to gather without seeing the actual happenings on a line level. I could be wrong


#8

Off topic but I would like to see others use of water heater on a daily basis and how much “in” time they have.


#9

This would be something for the Sense engineers to answer, not a bunch of non engineers that don’t necessarily have a thorough or correct understanding of how Sense operates. :wink:

But to use another example, anyone who’s ever owned an old car and listened to the alternator whine through the AM radio can attest to the fact that electrical noise can be a very real issue. :wink:


#10

Electrical noise at my facility is the bane of my existence - a constant battle. My issues are mostly harmonic noise from very large and numerous VFD’s, but there are a myriad of noisy cantankerous devices out in the real world.